I’m going to probably do a spoiler-rich rundown of problems/things i liked about the movie later, but for now I just wanted to say that the flick was at least worth seeing. Let’s run down the good and the bad really quick, although if you’re reading this you’re probably going to see it anyway, so what the Hell does my opinion matter anyway?
The Good:
- Kung Fu. The action was superb.
- Neo flying, especially at the end
- Interesting plot devices
And of course, The Bad:
- Zion. Not only boring, but embarassing.
- Dialogue. Did they consult George Lucas on some of this drivel?
- The music. Hey guys, this flick called The Matrix flawlessly put together music with action. I suggest you watch it and take notes before you finish up Revolutions.
- CGI. C’mon now. You have a budget as big as the national defecit. Let’s see some results, you pricks.
- Character develpment, or lack thereof. (IE: Who the fuck was that? x 20)
That’s all I can really go into without spoiling anything for you. The movie itself was fine by me as soon as the Zion scene was over (which was as embarrassing as watching a softcore porno with your parents) but it still wasn’t spectacular. Way too many questions are left unanswered, especially the one about why Neo can’t train anyone to be like him, or why he’s kind of a pansy compared to what you expected at the end of the first flick.
Great action flick though. If you can remember that it’s really not supposed to be anything other than that, you’re ok. Except for the part where you see Keanu’s butt. That, I could have done without.
Sharkey, Check that…You’ve closed your tag , you’ve moved the frontpage over.We still have to wait til the 21st over here in Limey land, they must be floating the reels over or something. It’s a sad day when Canadia gets something before us.
ZionI was waiting for Britney Spears to start singing “I’m a slave for you in” the Zion dance part.
ULThanks, for some reason I have a retardation of the brain that makes me open with a UL and close with an OL.
Re: ZionI wouldn’t have complained! (Britney Spears)
i thought it was good.I dont see the big deal, it seems as though everyone is all shitty that they actually tried to incorporate a movie plot into this flick. As for the cgi; yes, it could have been done better. Zion is important, whats the point in saving something that has no life? As for all the unanswered questions, are they not releasing another movie? Im sure the whole point of this movie is to answer the already unanswered questions from the last. The last movie is to make it all come together. Keep in mind this is a trilogy; not 3 individual movies or a part 2/part 3. This is more like one giant movie revolving around what happens to the characters. Even more so, did anyone catch the fact that there is another red pill/blue pill plot going on here with trinity and neo? I’m sure that everything will be tied together at the end of the next. I think the movie was fantastic, and its leaving me wondering what’ll be coming up for the next one. I’m just sick of people expecting Revolutions to be as revolutionary as the first Matrix. I doubt the Wachowski brothers were only thinking of making Revolutions one-up the original, they were more interested in finishing up an already interesting idea. That’s my 2 cents… bring on the comments
UhI liked Neo’s butt.Weeeee!
matrix reloadedjesus fucking christ. what the hell is up with sequels sucking this past year? first, the newest ginormous disapointment of a star wars film, followed by the totally inferior lord of the rings movie, and now this? did the brothers forget to sell their souls this time like they did for the first film? i knew it seemed weird, keanu reeves doing a good job in a good film? now i know it was a fucking aborition. if they dont pull some extraordinary shit out of their sleeves for the third film, this will be the most disappointing trilogy this side of a galaxy far far away.
omgwtfbbqThis is the singularly greatest movie ever, except for that Zion dance crap.The plot twist at the end, and if you’ve seen it you know which I mean, is the greatest cinamatic plot twist since Darth Vader being Luke’s father.If that doesn’t make you go omgwtfbbq, then you’re clearly a communist.
for the people who forgot about aniMatrixlike i dont know how many people making these comments watched animatrix, but thats pretty much a neccesity. you miss so much if you havent seen that. it explains everything and beyond.
I wonder if..I was thinking during the sex scene if some pervert has a fetish for those holes..
the plotPeople can say the plot sucks but when you look at it as a whole it rocks. I’ll stick with Sharkey’s method The bad:13th floor remake so farHumans vs. Machines has been done before (T1/2/3)The good:It’s not just 1 giant evil AI programming vs. the world. There are rogue programs, versions, remakes of the matrix, etc. Its more deep than a giant server mastermind (or mastermold)Neo’s plot twist is that he is really a program. Now who programmed him and when? Any humans left in the real world could have programmed a virus. The war could still be going on and no one knows since most people are stuck in the matrix. Everyone could be in the matrix and just waiting for Neo’s program to fully execute itself.Philosophy above 99.99% of action films. Delving deep into what is reality, real, cause and effect in human behavior. Why does Agent Smith still try to kill Neo if he is freed (If Matrix is destroyed he dies as well). Why does Neo fight for the humans (programmed that way). Why does the oracle help or hurt? Why did the council believe in Morpheus (he could be a huge pawn inside the oracle’s, architect’s, and council’s plan)?Oh yeah, the machine guns, cars flipping, buildings blowing up, and hundred Smith’s all fighting 1 neo rocked too.And if you think it sucked go watch daddy daycare and get some real perception. Don’t let media hype make you say something stupid. Its hard to spend 300 million and make 2 shitty movies unless your last name rhymes with Hucas.
Who da Fuck cares…I don’t go to the Movies to watch the dam thing half the time anyways, i go there to check out your females, undressing them with my eyes and having my way with them while your ingrossed in the movie, popcorn is sexy!
AsshatNeo can’t be a program, fucktard. He can exist outside of the Matrix. You know, in the ‘real world’?
I’m a Communist…But all y’all already knew that.Choice, change, control. Could they have mentioned those pseudo-philosophical themes anymore in the movie? At least the action was nifty.
How sure are you..That’s the real world starseeder ..?
yeahSharkey, the reason Neo can do what he does, and the reason he can’t teach other people what he does, is because he is the remainder of that 99.9% result of the equation.Neo isn’t a program, he’s an anamoly. or anomaly, hand me a dictionary.He passes out in the end, because he realizes the \”real\” world isn’t so real, in fact, it’s the real matrix. Matrix within a matrix.
starseeder is the asshat.Starseeder, you dumb mother fucker. Who the fuck was te guy who tried to kill Neo in Zion? That was Agent-fucking-Smith that went through the telephone and back into the real world. Agent Smith downloaded himself into a person you fucktard. Why do you think that guy was cutting his hand… as a computer, he’d have no idea bout how shit like that feels. Have you even seen the movie? and if so… how stoned were you???
starseeder is the asshat.Starseeder, you dumb mother fucker. Who the fuck was te guy who tried to kill Neo in Zion? That was Agent-fucking-Smith that went through the telephone and back into the real world. Agent Smith downloaded himself into a person you fucktard. Why do you think that guy was cutting his hand… as a computer, he’d have no idea bout how shit like that feels. Have you even seen the movie? and if so… how stoned were you???
a couple of gripes…I own Matrix on DVD. Correct me if I’m wrong, but did they, or did they not show someone surgically removing those little metal discs all over Neo’s body? But in the now infamous, \”Zion\” dance recital, both bone & body, we find Neo covered in them – as well as the other cast members that seemed to lack them before (ie Trinity’s neck, etc.)The music was also lacking – Didn’t P.O.D. release a song that was supposed to be the title track – I don’t remember hearing it at all – unless it was during a massive fight scene I got sucked in too much.Also – Tank was replaced because of a \”class\” society!?!?! WTF? Has Zion gone India on us? And nevermind the weak-ass assasin. Couldn’t they have casted a better, more menacing person to play him? Boba Fett commanded his screen presence, but this guy…?And my last gripe – when confronted with the master program architect, a program himself, couldn’t Neo have leaped his ass into him like he did to Mr. Smith in the first movie?Oh, and if Mr. Smith turns out to be Neo’s Father, I’ll be super whoop-ass pissed! {tho I do think he’ll turn out to be a good guy when this is all said and done.}~sparky
Strike that comment…As civicdmf points out – and I think this bare repeating – Neo has figured something out. He, \”felt\” the presence of the killer machines. This took place in the \”real\” world.You may be on to something as I guess I never caught that.I also forgot that Smith came back through the Matrix. He’s the assassin. Now I’m going to have to go and see it again tonght!
there would be no pointThere would be no point in jumping inside the Architect, as he didn’t really serve any other purpose as to tell Neo what was going on.It would have taken valuable time away from him saving Trinity.If Agent Smith turns out to be a good guy, I’ll have a fucking sex change operation, it isn’t going to happen. Smith is trying to kill Neo for obvious reasons, he wants to stay free. He likes his freedom, and he’ll be damned if he loses it.I don’t recall them removing the plugs, I recall them fucking with them however.
smith=good?smith can’t possibly be ‘good’. in fact, his trying to kill neo period is retarded. if he kills neo, the entire matrix crashes. they need him to maintain the cycle that keeps the matrix running. by killing him, smith would commit suicide, and because he’s finally free within the matrix that would be pointless. his obsession with killing neo could either be a part of the grand design of the matrix, or the agents could be ignorant to the true workings of the system. either way, i’m lookin forward to the third
I dont think so.I don’t think the Matrix would instantly crash. Does your computer crash instantly if left on too long? Mind doesn’t. It just sucks a mean dick, and not in the good way. And I think an insanely advanced system such as the matrix would run without being rebooted, just not at long. I think he is either wanting to stop Neo from rebooting so he doesn’t lose his freedom, or he has some other motives. Who knows, I guess we just have to wait.
I dont think so.I don’t think the Matrix would instantly crash. Does your computer crash instantly if left on too long? Mind doesn’t. It just sucks a mean dick, and not in the good way. And I think an insanely advanced system such as the matrix would run without being rebooted, just not at long. I think he is either wanting to stop Neo from rebooting so he doesn’t lose his freedom, or he has some other motives. Who knows, I guess we just have to wait.
AlsoI don’t think Sharkey was was watching the same movie.Neo a pansy in Reloaded? Where at? Bad character development? Any character with a small part, you know what that small part was. There was nothing wrong with the characters. I never found myself once saying \”who’s that\”. Sharkey must have been drunk, or something.
Character DevelopmentThe only real lack of character development issues I had were with the \”twins.\” Other than badass body guards, there is more to them, and I would expect to learn more about them in the finale of this series. Everyone else pretty much had their roles or purpose explained adequately, especially for what is really only half of a movie.
Gripes – part 2Okay, so I saw the movie again last night. Then this morning, I took another look at the first Matrix, specificly the part where they free Neo (chapter 11). They do indeed show some sort of surgery on the \”buds\” that are attached all over his body, but it’s not clear as to wether they are removing them or just futzing with them.I also found it rather inconsistant that at times during reloaded, the \”buds\” were flat, and in others protruding. Also they are sometimes black and plastic looking, but in the Matrix they are most definitely metallic.Also – in The Matrix (chapter 13), Morpheus goes on to tell of the legend of how when the Matrix was first formed, there was a man born inside who had the ability to change things and make things as he saw fit. He freed the first of the Humans and taught them the truth. After he died, the oracle prophesied his return, and that his coming would hail the destruction of the Matrix and end the war and bring freedom to the people. Morpheus believed that search to be over, inferring that Neo was that person.Interesting also that the Architect says talks about how he created the Matrix and didn’t mention a single person, but several people. 16 female and 7 men. And then Tank, during the training excersize remarks about Neo, \”He’s a machine.\” Is that being clever or foreshadow? Will Neo turn out to be a \”program?\”Finally – Going back to Reloaded, I think after Neo left the Source room to go back to the Nebekenezzer, something changed. He’s got to be back in a Matrix-esque scenario in order to \”feel\” the machines, right?Discuss.
a couple interesting thingsfirst of all, those plugs were never removed, they were only messed with a little. If you remember after he wakes up the pulls a needle of some sort out of one of the plugs on his arm, clearly showing they were never removed. Second, just in case you didn’t catch this. In the first matrix, when neo is arrested it shows a bunch of, what seem to be secuirity cameras looking at him, then it zooms into one of them and proceeds to go in with his interogation. those tvs are the exact same tvs in the architect’s room. That has nothing to do with anything, i just found it interesting.i’ll have some more stuff later, i gotta take care of stuff, but the smith can’t be good because he tried to take over neo in that park. Neo most likely isn’t a program because he was freed like everyone else, not just created. and lastly consider that maybe the architect was full of shit and only said those things to further confuse neo as to what he had to do. not sure about that one, but something to consider.
Think about it…\”Also – in The Matrix (chapter 13), Morpheus goes on to tell of the legend of how when the Matrix was first formed, there was a man born inside who had the ability to change things and make things as he saw fit. He freed the first of the Humans and taught them the truth. After he died, the oracle prophesied his return, and that his coming would hail the destruction of the Matrix and end the war and bring freedom to the people. Morpheus believed that search to be over, inferring that Neo was that person.\”The ‘One’ aka Neo was to choose the 16 men and 7 women, thereby ‘freeing’ the first of them to start Zion over… It makes sense. And since they kill all the people and the others have no idea of the things in the past when they are freed, like the Architect said, the Matrix would be, for all intents and purposes destroyed and the war over. But it doesn’t say that they won’t both start again… Over and over…
TrustThe Oracle said that it was up to Neo to decide if he trusted her. Now, if she raises doubts about her motives, why should we/he blindly accept the Architect’s blatherings as Truth?Seriously, couldn’t that all just be bullshit?The door Neo chose went back to the Matrix so that he could save Trinity. But we don’t know what was behind Door #2. It could’ve been the mainframe.
ZionDid anyone else get the impression that about 90% of the people in Zion were some odd African/Arabic/Indian hybrid minority? I’m sure this has absolutely no significance, but I’m just wondering what the thought process behind it was when they were designing the scene.
..if he could feel those droids then i guess the real world probably exist’s within the second level of the matrix or something…
.. continuedsince all matter is a collection of energy patterns and physical existence is false.. then true existence and existence within the matrix can be identical… blah.. crap… something deep about the true architech
wtfAfter reading through these posts my brain kinda hurts but now i’m wondering if you guys are over analysing…I mean, it is what it is, the dumbest fucker in the world can enjoy it without questioning the storyline. Yeah, there may be parts to it that are hard to understand but damn, there’s still more to the story.The next big headline in the news will probably read a lil something like this… \”Geeks heads explode while trying to figure out the storyline of The Matrix\” Sorry to catagorise you all as geeks but that’s tabloids for ya
Assassin Character…to who was talking about the assassin character….did you notice that it was cypher? i thought it was. though the thought that it was smith copied and download, and that was why he was cuttin his hand to feel ‘real’ pain does make sense…but i thought it was cypher…i am probably wrong..also..did anyone understand the scene near the beginning where neo walked into a apartment(?) room, looked around, seeing a couch and some furniture, and then it cut to the next scene? that made no sense..and another..when the new operator, i forget his name, puts the necklace on his neck near the end, the next shot over his shoulder shows it wrapped around his hand again….
CypherNo, it was not Cypher. It was Bane.And yes, this movie had a predominantly minority cast.Ebert thinks it’s because the slacker generation associates Black with Beautiful, I mean Cool. Pat Buchanan thinks it’s all part of the conspiracy to eradicate the White Man.
My takeI think one of the idea expressed by the architect was that the matrix couldn’t exist and be believed without the human mind having some idea of hope or choice, even if it’s subcontious and not realized by most people, a flaw esentially created by the oracle. Maybe what we feel is the real world, where Zion exists, is just another aspect of the Matrix. A place where hope can exist to keep the human’s minds from not believeing the Matrix exists and killing themselves. Humans need a hero or something to believe in, so The One exists for that. Oh yeah, the room at the begining Neo runs into and is empty was the Oracles old apartment from the first movie I believe.
my thoughtsThe reason for the \”minority cast\” is probably just that the last \”one\” was black and picked black people to continue zion. As for Neo’s \”powers\” in the \”real world\”, I think the nearby ship just EMP’d at the right time… not sure why he felt them.Pretty obvious how the next one is going to go though… they have 24 hours to save the world with neo in a coma… but wait! maybe Neo can still go in the matrix when he is in a coma! Morpheous dies a heroic death; everyone lives happily ever after, with Trinity having Neo’s baby… but whatever
trailerBtw, how many people sat through the credits? There was a trailer for revolutions at the end.
trailer / emp / aptI’ve seen the movie twice now, I saw it Wednesday night, and just about everyone stayed to watch the trailer. Then I saw it again Friday night, only about 1/2 the movie stayed to watch the trailer.That’s an interesting perspective about the EMP triggering at the right time to stop the Sentinels…hadn’t heard of / thought about that concept yet. That seems to me to be the most logical solution – good thinking. (Does anybody else have trouble remembering the word \”Sentinel\”? I can never remember the damn word, always gotta look it up or ask somebody.And as for the apartment where Neo flies into, yes that is the Oracle’s apartment from the first movie (as HybridAndy said). If you notice, he mumbles/whispers \”Where are you?\” while standing in the room, referring to the Oracle, whom they are all awaiting contact from.
well, in a world where..people are hooked up to giant computer to give some robots..Neo feeling the Sentinals coming due to him being in another matrix makes more sense than the nearby ship busting out the EMP. If I’m not mistaken, isn’t the ship shown for a brief second after the Sentinals fall? If so, then the EMP theory is bunk, because the EMP will shut the ship down. But I’m not sure.And for Neo passing out, what about that? The more logical theory is that he was in fact in another matrix, not the EMP. There is only one thing supporting the EMP theory, and two supporting the Matrix within a Matrix theory.
edit*give robots energy*
two matrixs?OK… I dont think there is any way the brothers would do something as lame and cliche as having another matrix inside the matrix. Plus in the trailer there is no indication of it… actually, i didnt notice, but is their any shots of neo in the \”real\” world? I don’t remember any. Btw the ship was shown about 30 seconds to a minute after Neo supposedly \”shocked\” the sentinels. I think thats long enough for them to turn the ship back on. And if the ship was that close and didn’t help them (obviously they have radars that could see the sentinels to) then they would be bastards. But who knows… I hope neo doesnt become \”the one\” in the \”real\” world… start shooting lasers out of his eyes and shit…
re: two matrixs?\”OK… I dont think there is any way the brothers would do something as lame and cliche as having another matrix inside the matrix. \”Yeah, I didn’t think George Lucas could destroy the hearts of millions, but he did that with alarming alacrity. Besides, the Watchowskis probably saw The Thirteenth Floor and got lazy. Nah, what am I saying. Nobody saw The Thirteenth Floor. There must be another explanation.
blacks and smithWhile not EVERYONE in Zion was african american/black/indian etc…ALL of the \”Captians\” were and Whitey was still runnin’ shit. What (if anything) does that mean? Also…there had better be a matrix in the matrix otherwise Smith coming through the phone is REALLY lame. I mean he doesn’t \”exist\”. O.K. maybe if he came through at an Everyquest convention but, other wise a computer program ain’t taking over a human \”brain\”
mafianinja:Ok, you know how if someone dies in the matrix, their \”real\” body dies? The matrix has complete control of their mind while they’re inside, so if something is changed in the matrix, it changes back in their \”real\” mind, also. When smith dialed out, he dialed into Smith-with-a-goatee’s head, so it was Agent Smith in that guy’s body.Ok, next part. Remember how Agent Smith said he was supposed to be deleted, but he couldn’t? Something compelled him, and he came back changed? Also, remember when Neo died in the Matrix, and felt compelled to return, and came back with his powers? They could have transferred out to the \”real\” world, but I agree: That would be gay.
Minority commentsI’m glad somebody else had the balls to point out the whole \”minorities running the show\” observation. I didn’t want to bring it up and look like a friggin Klan idiot.Isn’t it weird that we should notice it still? As much as I would consider myself \”non-racial,\” it still stuck out in my mind.Anyway, I did want to point out that in addition to African Americans, Indians and obvious minorities present – I did see several noticable Maori (like the guy who played Jenga Fett). These are the natives of New Zealand that tend to wear the elaborite tribal tattoos on their faces. An amazing people group if you ever cared to explore a foreign culture. That, and New Zealand is a beautiful place to visit.
raceI just figured everyone looked about the same and in the middle of the road of all races because a thousand years in the future, there would only be a couple of strands of pure race, and the rest would be a melting pot of interracial parents. I mean, after a while, wouldn’t we all be mocha?
Me me meWhen Neo jumped into Smith in the Matrix, Smith said that Neo had transferred a part of him. They could feel eachother. We have established that neo can also feel Smith. If smith can now come into the real world, is it impossible that Neo might have taken some of Smith into him as well? Perhaps that switch is what allowed him to EMP the machines in the real world.
Smith DebateWhen you’re in the Matrix, your brain is the equivalent of a computer, uploading and downloading info across the connection. So everything in your brain is available to be copied, pasted, fondled…erm…et cetera.So. Neo managed to copy part of himself over Smith’s program in the Matrix, and Smith copied part of himself onto Neo (upload, download, etc). Smith was still a program at that point. The reason he’s in the real world is that Smith completely overwrote Bane with a copy of Smith’s programming. The reason Smith was able to enter the real world is not because there’s a 2nd Matrix–although that’s a possibility, and a really shitty one, I might add–but because he copied himself over an identity that had a physical, human presence outside the Matrix.So. Smith overwrote a human’s programming in the Matrix and then uploaded himself into the connection feeding back to Bane’s brain.
another thoughtabout the scene where Neo try’s to stop the sentinels…maybe he just got lucky…in fact it almost fits perfectly…Think about the scene again \” baddies are coming..neo trips out and stops…he says something is \”differnt\”…puts out his hand and stops the machines and tools himself at the same time\”…or could it be that the Electro-static discharge from the ship getting close to Neo and the droids be the reason for his \”unexplained\” powersin the real world
Matrix in MatrixIm not sure where, but I saw an article where the Wachowski Bros actually said there is not a Matrix in a Matrix, which is good because that would be stupid. Havent found the article again but if I do ill post a link.
Smith stuffAt the captains meeting at the beginning of the movie, after Neo beats up the 3 agents and flys away, it shows Agent Smith talking to another Agent Smith. He says \”It’s all happening exactly like before.\” \”Well not EXACTLY like before\”.I think this proves that the Architect is telling the trust about the 6 Zions being destroyed before, and Neo not being the first \”One\”.Also, in one of the two trailers for Revolutions, it shows Smith and Neo fighting and seems to say/elude to the fact that everything comes down to their fight. Smith definatly isn’t good. It also REALLY looked like he flew through a wall like Neo can do in one of the quick shots.
the frenchaythat frenchay who makes the girl nut with the choc cake also says, i survived your predecesors and i will survive you, at least twice.
Architect of TruthThe fact that there were predecessors, and the Merovingian validates that fact, does not prove the Architect told the whole truth.Hell, even Arafat knows that the best lies and manipulations start with a kernel of truth.
MinoritiesI read a review that I thought summed up the minority issue pretty well: \”…most of the people in Zion seem to be black or Hispanic, which makes perfect sense: If you’re a white suburban Matrix resident, driving your Matrix SUV to your Matrix golf club, why doubt the nature of reality?\”
MinoritiesI read a review that I thought summed up the minority issue pretty well: \”…most of the people in Zion seem to be black or Hispanic, which makes perfect sense: If you’re a white suburban Matrix resident, driving your Matrix SUV to your Matrix golf club, why doubt the nature of reality?\”
Think about it…What about when Smith did his goo stuff on Neo… Would it not have transfered part of Smith into Neo? Like the guy he took over in the other ship. That seems like the most plausible way to explain how he ‘felt’ the machines since Smith was the one that controlled them in the first movie. How he did the EMP is beyond me at this point though. =\